In this unforgettable episode of Still Here Hollywood, Ted Lange, forever known as Isaac from The Love Boat, joins Steve Kmetko for a deep, funny, and brutally honest conversation about classic television, Hollywood power dynamics, racial inequality in entertainment, and the long game of creative survival. Ted takes us behind the scenes of one of the most iconic shows in television history, sharing stories about Gene Kelly, Diahann Carroll, Cloris Leachman, Howard Keel, and the revolving door of legendary guest stars that made The Love Boat a cultural phenomenon. He reveals what really went on when the cameras stopped rolling and how respect, chemistry, and mentorship made the cast a family. But this episode goes far beyond nostalgia. Ted opens up about the realities of being a Black actor in Hollywood, the battles he fought for equal treatment, fair representation, and meaningful storylines, and how he learned to “pivot” rather than become bitter. His stories about pay disparity, industry politics, and subtle discrimination are powerful, eye-opening, and still painfully relevant today. We also dive into Ted’s remarkable second act as a writer, director, and playwright. From directing television to writing over 27 plays, including historical dramas about forgotten figures like John Hanson and Mary Bowser, Ted explains how storytelling can reclaim lost history and give voice to those erased from textbooks. His passion for uncovering untold stories turns this episode into something far bigger than a Hollywood interview. Plus, he shares hilarious and unexpected stories about working with Jenna Jameson on the “Ask Isaac” advice column, his Shakespeare adaptations, directing The Fall Guy, and the surprising friendships that shaped his career. This is a masterclass in resilience, creativity, and navigating Hollywood with intelligence, humor, and integrity. Ted Lange proves he is far more than a TV icon. He is a historian, a playwright, a director, and a truth teller who is very much still here.
Steve Kmetko
Yes, I'm Still Here Hollywood. And coming up on today's episode.
Steve Kmetko
Back in the day. Saturday night television was a huge opportunity for the three networks to create Family TV. And for a decade, starting in the late 1970s, there was a show that besides topping the ratings, was family friendly and also became a huge promotion for sailing vacations. Let's just call it the pre precursor to today's Below deck.
This is Still Here Hollywood. I'm Steve Kmetko. Join me with today's guest, Isaac from a Love Boat, Ted Lange.
If you'd like to be more involved with us at Still Here Hollywood, you definitely can just visit patreon.com/StillHereHollywood. You can support us for as little as $3 a month. You can get our episodes a day before they post anywhere else. You can see what guests will be coming up and submit questions for them. You can even tell us what stars you want us to have on as guests. You'll see what goes on before and after the episode plus exclusive behind the scenes info picks video and more. Again, that's patreon.com/StillHereHollywood.
Thanks, Ted, for coming to sit in on our little podcast here Still Here Hollywood.
Ted Lange
I'm Still Here, Steve.
Steve Kmetko
Yeah, so am I. But I come back and forth from Chicago. You live in San Diego?
Ted Lange
Well, we live in Oceanside, which is about 40 minutes outside.
Steve Kmetko
Right.
Ted Lange
Of North of--
Steve Kmetko
So beautiful down there.
Ted Lange
Oh, It's gorgeous.
Steve Kmetko
If you're going to retire, that's a place to do it. [Crosstalk]--
Ted Lange
That's really place to do it.
Steve Kmetko
If you can afford it.
Ted Lange
And the beauty of it is my wife's family is all in Oceanside, so.
Steve Kmetko
You were talking about taking the train up?
Ted Lange
Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
You and your wife.
Ted Lange
Mm-Hmm.
Steve Kmetko
I've never taken it up here, but I've taken it down to San Diego and on a number of occasions and the one time I didn't take it, I was really sorry because it was on Thanksgiving Day and I drove down because I have a, yes. I have a cousin who lives in San Diego and he usually sponsors Thanksgiving when I lived up here. That was the longest four hours I'm sure of my life. [Crosstalk]--
Ted Lange
I'm sure.
Steve Kmetko
It was a good double what it normally is, you know? Did you have any favorite guest stars who appeared on the Love Boat?
Ted Lange
Oh God, yes. Yes. Gene Kelly. Gene Kelly appeared on our show. And the, the mucky Muck said, don't talk to Gene. He's a grumpy guy. Okay. So don't just leave him alone. When you do your scenes fine, but don't talk to Gene. And so, every-- we all said, okay, yeah, fine. So, we were in Hong Kong and we're sitting in a little van and we're waiting, I'm waiting to shoot a scene with Gene Kelly. So, he's sitting there, he's reading a magazine, and he wore contacts and glasses. Okay. So, he's sitting there and he's reading, and I said, screw this. I'm going to go talk to Gene Kelly. So I go, he's sitting in one chair and I sit across and I go, hi, and he's kind of, he's reading and he looks up at me and he, yeah. And he goes back to reading. I said, can I ask you a question? You can see him go. What? I said, what was it like dancing with the Nicholas Brothers? Now for your audience that don't know who they are, there are two Black Tap dancers out of the Cotton Club back at Harlem Renaissance. And he put, gene put them in his movies. So--
Steve Kmetko
He did and they did some wonderful numbers together.
Ted Lange
Oh my God. They were incredible dancers. So, he did like this. You want to know about the Nicholas Brothers? And I said, yeah. So, he told me this wonderful story about the Nicholas Brothers. And then they call us on the set. We go on the set, we do a scene together, then we're done. And we come, go back to the bus, the little bus. He says, hey, you want to have a drink with me at the hotel? I said, yeah. Sure.
Steve Kmetko
Do I?
Ted Lange
Do I? And so, we I hooked up with him after we'd finished our day's work. I hooked up with him, sat down in the hotel, and he was wonderful. It was totally different. And then on reflection, I said, I bet everybody, when they get a chance to talk to him, talks about singing in the rain. I had no interest in singing in the Rain, because I knew the Nicholas Brothers --you know-- so that was, it was great.
Steve Kmetko
Well, also it would be I don't know what I would do if I was put in that situation and then told You can't talk to this person about whatever. Because I mean, sitting across from Gene Kelly, you'd have a million questions to ask about. Who else besides Gene Kelly?
Ted Lange
Oh, Diahann Carroll. I kissed Diahann Carroll. I'm sorry, Mary. I kissed, that's my wife--
Steve Kmetko
His wife--
Ted Lange
I kissed Diahann Carroll about 15 times before she realized I was messing up on purpose. So, then she says, hey, hey, cut that out. I said, okay, I'm sorry. You're just so beautiful. You're just so--
Steve Kmetko
she was one of the most beautiful women I've ever seen.
Ted Lange
Oh Man.
Steve Kmetko
Dropped dead. Stop you in your tracks. Yeah.
Ted Lange
And she could kiss.
Steve Kmetko
That I never learned.
Ted Lange
That's my claim to Famous. And she could kiss. So yeah, it was fun. So, she was a delight. You know, Fred Grandy and I had a thing called the Goldwin Club, where we would take the older guest stars and take them out to lunch. And they go, why are you taking me out to lunch? He said, we just want to, we want to buy you lunch. So, it'd be me and Fred and whoever the guest Jack Gilford. So, Jack, can we ask you something after you've ordered this lunch, can we ask you something? Oh, I see what this is. You want some stories? And we said, yeah. And he told me a wonderful story about how he was in New York, an actor. And this black woman daughter was a dancer in the chorus at the Cotton Club. And the daughter said to the mom, I want to be an actress.
I want to have a career in show business. And so, they said, well, wait a minute. Wait a minute. You don't know what you're doing. We don't know what you're doing. We're going to get somebody to watch you. And we'll, if that person says you have talent, then we'll support you a hundred percent. So, this mother sends Jack Gilford to the Cotton Club. I don't know how she knew him or what, but Jack Gilford goes to the Cotton Club to watch this girl in the chorus. And he comes back and he tells somebody she's got talent. She's got talent. You mean Helena Horn has talent? Yes. Your daughter Helena Horn. Although I would drop the Helena and just call her Lena. So that's, you know, those are the thing, the great thing about our shows is that we would have those rising, like Tom Hanks and Martin Short and Billy Crystal and those that had been retired and were coming back and kind of doing a, maybe even a swan song appearance Howard Keel who did Kismet and stuff.
Steve Kmetko
Annie Get Your Gun.
Ted Lange
Annie Get Your Gun. He revitalized his career on our show. It was the first time he'd worked in years. And Aaron's Spelling was an extra in Kismet.
Steve Kmetko
Really?
Ted Lange
Yes. Arms for the Poor. If you ever see Kismet in the first five minutes of the movie, Arms for the Poor, that's Aaron's Spelling. So, he is looking around and he is going, geez, he was an extra in my thing. And that, look at what he's done. And but Howard Keel did a scene, I'll never forget, he did a scene and they said, cut print. And everybody walked away. And he went like this. And I went, I said, what's the matter? He said, that wasn't it. I'm better than that. I could do it better. I said, well, let's call them back and do it again. He says, no, no. They like what they saw. I just happened to know I could do better.
Steve Kmetko
What I got inside me.
Ted Lange
Yeah. So, you can't call him back, just move on. And so, towards the end of the second day, I saw him do this. He did the scene and then he went like this, Steve. Yeah. He got it back. He got it back. And so, I said, how is that? He said, I'm rolling now. You know, so it that it was, it was experiences like that. Gavin was great because towards the end of the first year, Fred and I kind of got a big head. You know, we got a big head and, because we were young. We were in our third 20 something 30. And Gavin said, hey, hey, come here you two. Him and Bernie. Bernie Kopell. Because they'd been around a long time. They said, listen, this is not how you handle people that guessed on our show. You go up to them, you shake their hand and thank them for being here. You show them where craft services are. If they need to know the makeup room, you show them where that is. And any way that you can be helpful to those celebrities that are here, you be helpful.
Steve Kmetko
They were all the guest stars, special guest stars that you've had on that you had on that show were probably a big percentage of why it was on so long. People love seeing those old, I shouldn't say old--
Ted Lange
But no, no, but--
Steve Kmetko
They seasoned performers veterans.
Ted Lange
Yeah. They were veterans. But here's the other thing, the other thing is, we as a cast got along and I think that was primary because I did a previous series where there was fighting and walking off and, you know--
Steve Kmetko
Storing out.
Ted Lange
Oh man. And I want his joke. And then, whereas on Love Boat, it was, I think Isaac should say this. Okay. Oh well. Okay. And then so that we were, particularly Fred and I, we had and you can't bottle this. I mean, you know, you don't know what the formula is, but two strangers walk on the set and have immediate chemistry. And that has translated to recently Fred and I did. I'm not Rapaport. We did it together, still have our comedic chemistry. And we added Jill into the mix on this last run that we did. I'm not Rappaport where she played Fred's daughter. And we, it was big hit. We were in Michigan, and it was a big hit. But you don't know someone's timing when you first walk on there and you got, you have to be generous with the other actor or you're going to miss it. And we were all Bernie, Gavin, Jill, Tweeze, we were all generous with each other. There was no competition other than when I say my line, I'm going to be funnier than you. No, you're not. Oh, watch this. You know, that's what we did. And I've been on the other end of that stick where can't wait to get home.
Steve Kmetko
When Gilligan went to work on the SS Minnow, it was supposed to be for a three-hour cruise on the love boat. You were on for 10--
Ted Lange
Yes. 10 years.
Steve Kmetko
10 years. Did you expect it to last that long when it started?
Ted Lange
Gavin did. We didn't, Fred and I, because I had a deal with Jimmie Komack. You remember Jimmie Komack?
Steve Kmetko
Oh yeah.
Ted Lange
Jimmie Komack, I did a series for him called Mr. T and Tina with Pat Marita. Okay. And I had a guest spot that turned into a regular, and he fell in love with my comedy. So, he says, listen my friend Aaron Spelling wants you on this show. He says but if that doesn't work out, I'm going to do a series around you. At first it was going to be me and Pat, but the network didn't want Pat. And they wanted to give me some holding money so that I wouldn't take anything else. So, Komack said, hey, take the gig, but if it doesn't work out --you know-- they told him the premise and he went, that's not going to work out. He said, so he told me, he says, listen, I'm going to get you some holding money. And Fred had something else that he was up for. So, Fred and I are going to like, oh, you got these girls in bathing suits. This isn't reality. Nobody's going to watch this. And we would go on a cruise, and the cruise would all be elderly people. At the time we did the pilot, 77. There were no young people on the cruise. It was the swan song of your grandmother or your grandfather. They would take a cruise to Mexico, come back, and sometimes they didn't even make it back. They had refrigerators on the boat. Okay?
Steve Kmetko
Just in case.
Ted Lange
Yeah. Just in case. And they work. Hey, what happened to the lady with the thing and the thing? Oh, she got off in Mexico. She is not coming back. But so, Fred and I are going, we just don't see it. But Gavin said, this is a hit. And we said you sure--
Steve Kmetko
You remain very close with Gavin.
Ted Lange
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I have to be careful because I start crying when I talk about him.
Steve Kmetko
You were that close.
Ted Lange
He was the greatest guy ever.
Steve Kmetko
Did you consider him a mentor?
Ted Lange
Yes. And he didn't have to look out for me. He didn't have to do that. But he knew some of the crap I was going through just as a performer, as a black performer. You know, he had my back. You know, we had producers and same thing with Bernie and Fred. They had my back. We had a producer didn't want to write for me. He didn't want to write love stories for a black character. And Fred and Bernie noticed it. And I'm going to the guy saying, hey, can I, well, hey, what about, hey? And the guy's going, no, no. And what makes me mad is he was Canadian. He wasn't even American. Okay. So, Fred and Bernie wrote a story, a love story for me. Scatman, Caruthers and Verna Watson. They wrote a love story for me because this guy wouldn't do it, you know?
And I also used to say to the guy, I say, hey, look, you have all the white characters at the front of the show and at the end of the show, my character's not there. He says, well, you're a bartender. What would you be doing there? I said, well, you know what, Bernie's a doctor. He should be in Sick Bay, and the captain should be on the bridge. What are they doing there? He says, well, we're not writing you in. He says, look, you're an equal star. You know, it didn't you just come in, in the middle of the show. And then someone would come to me in the show and say, I'm having a problem with my wife. And I would say, hey, have you tried Scotch and Gin? Or something? And the guy would go, eh. And then he'd get back together with his wife at the end of the show. And they wouldn't let me come out and say, hey, I'm glad you took my advice. They would say, doc would say, I talked to Isaac. He found out you got back with your wife and he's happy it all worked out. Anything to keep me off--
Steve Kmetko
That sounds like take what you get and like it. Was their attitude?
Ted Lange
Yeah. It was totally that. It was totally that shut up and dribble. That's what it was. Yeah. Shut up and dribble. And so, and I would, every week I would take the script to him. I'd say, hey, you know, later on, I meet this guy. Can't we do something up front here? Like you do the other guys? So, here's how I got around it. Here's how I got around it. When they did Roots Two and they wanted me to play Alex Haley's father. Because Alex Haley's father was a short guy. He was five seven. Five six. So, they said, get Ted. So, we go to Aaron Spelling and he say, hey listen Ted would like to get some time away from the show because they're going to do Roots too. And Roots was a huge, phenomenal, phenomenal hit. And so, who wouldn't want, right? So, Aaron says, no, I don't let my stars guessed on anything else. I don't let him do movies. I don't, that's the fair faucet thing. She wanted do movies. He wouldn't let her Kate, what was Charlie's Angels, Kate Jackson. Jackson was supposed to be the girl in Kramer versus Kramer.
Steve Kmetko
Oh, right,
Ted Lange
Okay. Spelling wouldn't let her out. You know, Dustin Hoffman flew to LA to meet with Spelling wouldn't let her out. So, spelling goes, so I thought at the time I thought it was a black thing. You know, he's just doing this thing because I'm black. And then I saw these other things go down.
Steve Kmetko
And the role went to Meryl Streep and she won an Oscar.
Ted Lange
And she went, how does that make you feel?
Steve Kmetko
Yeah.
Ted Lange
You know, so, we say to Aaron, look you're not utilizing him. You use him in the middle of the show. You could schedule it so we can work around that. And he says, what do you mean we only use him? He said, yeah, he wants to be in the front. He wants to be on the end in the, you're not, you know, you're not even utilizing, you got everybody but him. And so, and said, well, wait a minute. because He didn't know. He didn't know. So, we have this meeting, and Gavin had some complaints too, because Gavin was an appendage to the guest star. He said, I want some stories. You're not, all I do is say, welcome aboard. And I'm glad you solved your problem, but I want some stories--
Steve Kmetko
[Crosstalk]--
Ted Lange
Yeah. You know. And, so Aaron said to the writer guy write, a producer says let's get Gavin some stories. And the guy says, okay, well we'll try and Ted, what is your thing? I said, well, the front and the back and blah, blah, blah. I say, well, he turns to the guy. Why is he only in, why isn't he in the front? Like everybody else said he's a bartender. Aaron, why would he be in the front of the show? That doesn't make any sense. And so, Aaron said, well, is there any reason he could be in the front of the show that a bartender would be? He said, well, if he was a head bartender and you could see the guy want to go, oh, I said the wrong thing. Let me police words out. You can see them, man. And Aaron said, make him head bartender. So, he did a whole episode on, I became the head bartender.
Steve Kmetko
We'll be back in a moment.
Ted Lange
One time Cloris Leachman daughter came on a cruise and she needed a shoulder to cry on and to talk to. Because She was going through a thing with her mom. And so, she came and knocked on my cabin door. I opened the door. I said, yeah, she's just can talk. I said, yeah, but I leave my door open because if I bring that girl into my cabin and close the door, you got to know this. There going to be some upset people. Girl was 17 too, at the time.
Steve Kmetko
Did you ever get bitter about this stuff?
Ted Lange
No. You can't be. Because it isn’t on me. It's on them. You know? Now you know, I don't have to hang out with you if I think that you're not righteous. I wrote a play called One Righteous White Boy. Do you know what a black entertainer needs to succeed in show business?
Steve Kmetko
What?
Ted Lange
One Righteous White Boy. And I did a thing, I wrote a thing for a guy named Jeff Wayne. And he's a white comedian, okay? He came to me with all of his material and he says, Ted, I want to put a one man show together. I said, write a script. Write a script, and then we'll talk about it. Now you, if you tell most comedians that write a script, you're done. They're not going to do it. They will, they'll say, come down and see my act. I'm not writing 10. Now Jeff did. He wrote a script. He said, I want to do this, I want to do that.
And so, I looked at it and I said, look, Jeff. Because it was very conservative, okay? His jokes were very conservative, mainly for white guys, okay? Right Wing White Guys. You know, Steve Bannon would love his humor that he did. So anyway, I said, okay, look Jeff, I edited his script. Can't do this joke. Why? Because it's a black joke. It's not funny. You said, I have guys laughing all the time. I said, they're white guys. And I said, let's cut that joke. I said, now you see this black joke here, black joke, this black people go, well that's kind of true. And they'll laugh. This one that they won't laugh. This one, that a lesbian joke. No lesbians going to find that funny. Amusing cut it. But this lesbian joke, they'll go, okay. And that's what they did. I went through the whole thing because they don't know where the line is.
And I made the line, okay, Steve, this thing took off like gangbusters. Everybody wanted the kid. They called him the new Archie Bunker, but they don't know where the line, I'm black, I know where the line is. Okay? So, we had a deal that Jeff and I would be partners in this. So, when he turned in the script, he put my name on the script and his name. This is Hollywood. Now this part is the dark side of Hollywood. Okay? So, first thing they tried to do is separate me and him. And they say, you don't need the guy. He said, no, that's Ted. Ted directed this. I wouldn't --you know-- I wouldn't have known anything. But he knew, how to make this you know, presentable to the general, you don't need them. And then they would corner me and they would say, let him go. I said, who, who the hell are you? He says, well, we are going to listen. I'm with a big agency and we always get our man, let him go. You're not going to, you are not going to make it from A to B. That's what they told me. Bernie Brustein, I have a great story. But we went to Bernie Brustein and Bernie Brustein. I'm sitting there, Jeff is sitting here, and he goes to Jeff. He says do we need him? And he goes, yeah, yeah, we need him. That's Ted. He directed it.
Do we need him? I'm sitting there with the talent. And this guy, this producer guy who has all the power, is basically saying, get rid of him. So, then he said, and, and Jeff kept affirming that he needed me. Finally, he said, do you have paper? Meaning, have you guys signed a contract? Oh, he said, yeah, we have paper Now. That was a lie. We didn't have any paper, but he's a Righteous White Boy. Okay? So, turn he went like this and turned to me, said, welcome aboard. Ted Shakes my hand, Bernie Brustein. Okay, so long story short, I go through a lot of things like that. Am I bitter? No, I'm not bitter. Because I know what you're doing. I see it coming. Am I bitter that we have a new president? No, but I saw this coming. You know, I saw all of that stuff's coming. What's the problem is, you guys don't recognize it, but I know a conman when I see one. You know what I'm saying? So, we go to William Morris and I don't mind sign saying the name William Morris. And I'm going to direct the pilot. Because I've been directing Jeff is going to star in the show.
And we got this name guy named Buddy Mora. He's a manager. He was like, Brustein. Buddy Moore, and we got an agent, Lee Cohen at William Morris. And Lee Cohen calls me up and they, they've assured me, he said, we love you Ted. Jeff trusts you. We want you to be with the show. It's a go two weeks before we're to meet with Universal NBC Lee calls me up. You know, Ted, we've been thinking about this and we think we need an A director. I said, I am a director. And he said, no, no, no. We're going to go with Jimmy Burs or Will McKenzie somebody like I said, what are you talking about? You represent me, you, what are you doing? He says, no, no, we feel that Jeff needs a polished hand, a veteran and you're not that I've been doing this since 67. So, what are you talking about? So, he says, well, you are out.
Steve Kmetko
Come on.
Ted Lange
That's what I said. Just like, and I said it just like you said it. I said, come on, what are you talking about? So, they go like this, Steve, they go like this. You're out. And I said, well, you can't do the show. They said, what do you mean we can't do the show? I said, because I own half of it. You don't own half of it. I said, check with the writers Gill. Just a minute. Call the writer Gill, tell them that my name is on the script. Because they said it's the guy's act. I said, but you didn't buy his act. You bought Big Daddy's barbecue, which was the name of the show. Big Daddy's Barbecue play open up in the backyard of guy's barbecue and grilling tells all these stories. So, comes back on the phone and says, well, maybe we were a little hasty. Because the kid likes you and you guys have a chemistry and this and that and this and that. So yeah, I mean, if you get into show business as a person of color, there's battles that you have to fight. They're not exactly the same as the other guys' battles, but you still got to fight them.
Steve Kmetko
And that's still the case today.
Ted Lange
Oh Baby, I can tell you stories right now. I'm trying to get my plays to theaters in New York. Well, you got to have a literary agent, then you get the literary agent and he won't send it in. What the, what are you talking about this? I did this play. This play won Best play NAACP and you can't get these guys to look at my play. And they can't say, well, you're black. They can't say that. You know, but you know what it is. So yeah, it's still going on. Paid discrepancy, pay discrepancy. You know how much I read that Ariana Grande got?
Steve Kmetko
I just read this too, as opposed to Cynthia Arrivo in Wicked.
Ted Lange
Now why does she get--
Steve Kmetko
I could not believe that.
Ted Lange
It's amazing, isn't it?
Steve Kmetko
Millions and millions of dollars difference.
Ted Lange
15 million to one 15 to one.
Steve Kmetko
Right.
Ted Lange
Come on. And they're both equal. They're both, you know, sorry, I heard about Danny Glover. Okay. Lethal Weapon--
Steve Kmetko
With Mel Gibson--
Ted Lange
Mel Gibson. They this is just to give you example.
Steve Kmetko
Right.
Ted Lange
Because the pay thing is going, is ongoing. So, they go to Mel and say, we want to give you 350 to sign on for Lethal Weapon. Two goes, okay, give him the check. Bang! Danny realized, what's a monster hit at this? He says, I want a million dollars. And he said, we're not giving you a million dollars. Get the hell out of here. So, he said, no, no, I want, this was a hit. I want a million dollars. And they, they've made a deal for mail to get seven. And Danny, they want him to have like 10% of that. They don't want to give him a million. So, they go to Mel and they said, look, Mel looks like we're going to have to get another, I'm sure they didn't say N word, but it looks like they have to get another guy for you. Maybe Ben Warren, [Uncertain Word] said somebody like that. And Mel Gibson goes, hey, no, the chemistry is me and this guy. They said, no, you don't understand. He wants a million dollars. He said, well, you're giving me seven. They go, we no, we're not giving this guy a million dollars. He said, well then I'm not doing it. He said, you have to do it. I'll give, he says, I'll return the money. I'm not doing it without him. You know how much they gave Danny Glover.
Steve Kmetko
How much?
Ted Lange
999,990, 900.
Steve Kmetko
Just because?
Ted Lange
And 99 cents. Now someone from Warner Brothers contracts told me that story. So, if it's a lie, it's on her. Hmm.
Steve Kmetko
Okay.
Ted Lange
So yes, the answer is it's going on right now. Still. Still. If I am white girl walks into my trailer, I'm leaving the door.
Steve Kmetko
Leave that door open.
Ted Lange
Open.
Steve Kmetko
What was your worst experience with a guest star?
Ted Lange
Worst experience is after Gavin told us, go up to the guest star, shake their hands and welcome him to the show. I went up to a guest star. I said, hey, my name is Ted Lash. Welcome to the show. Anyone like this and walked away. Well, who does that? To anybody? Who does that? To anybody? But I had on my little red jacket, there's a couple of other guys with red jackets. I guess he thought I was an extra. And even if he did, why would you do that to an extra? Hmm. Right. So, about a half hour later he comes up with the director and he says Ted, I want to introduce you to your scene partner here. So and so, so and so. And the guy looks, I'm nice to meet you. I went, yeah. And this guy was a fairly big guy and he used to have a golf and tennis thing--
Steve Kmetko
Tournament.
Ted Lange
Tournament. And every year he would invite me, but I already know who you are. Why would I go?
Steve Kmetko
Yeah.
Ted Lange
I know who you are.
Steve Kmetko
You want to let us in on who it was?
Ted Lange
No, I don't want to do that.
Steve Kmetko
Okay. I thought I'd give it a shot.
Ted Lange
Okay. No, I'm not going to say the guy from Dallas.
Steve Kmetko
Oh, really?
Ted Lange
Yeah, Steve. What it was his name? Steve, who was one of the lesser guys.
Steve Kmetko
There was a Steve, I can't remember his last name.
Ted Lange
I think. Yeah, well, that's who it was. And, and I was, you know, I was like, I don't believe you. Well, Dallas is in the south. Maybe that has something to do with, I don't know.
Steve Kmetko
I don't think Texas considers itself the south does it.
Ted Lange
I don't know.
Steve Kmetko
When Jill was here, she was telling us some experiences, bad experiences she had with Douglas Kramer. What were your experiences with him?
Ted Lange
Well, I knew who I was dealing with. See, the whole thing is you got to know who you're dealing with. If you know who you're dealing with, then you can--
Steve Kmetko
Navigate
Ted Lange
Yeah. You can navigate yourself through the thing. And Twiss made some mistakes. And those mistakes were with Douglas Kramer, but that's our boss, Douglas Kramer, Aaron spelling, those are our bosses, you know? So, if you understand that's your boss and you understand --you know-- where the deal is, you try not to, you try to navigate where you're going to go. But if, I mean, Jill was a little girl. Yeah. You know, I mean, so I mean, that's, and people say, hey, my kid wants to be in show business. I said, send them to dance class. Send them to voice lessons. Let them take acting classes. But don't let them be professional because they got to find out who they are first.
Yeah. Because I saw a couple of people. I see the other thing they used to do is they used to go around. Because I wanted to direct. I'd go around the different shows and watch the directors, or I'd make friends with a director. I said, can I come watch you? Yeah. And so that I'd do that. But I, what happens is sometimes the directors forget they're talking to a kid and they talk to them as if they're an adult. And then so, you have them treated a certain way. I remember Alan Rafkin, who was a director, he was working on one day at a time, and one of the kids on there said, turn to their father and said, get me a drink, a coke. Father got up and went and got the coke and Alan Rafkin was incensed and he pulled the kid away and he said, hey, that's your dad. You don't demand a coke from your dad. And that's a problem with kids in show business. I know they got to have them, but you see all of these guys going south --you know-- so I say, let the kid grow up. Because It's going to be tough enough as an adult to navigate where you're, what you're going to do to watch out for the drugs, to see who's leading you. You know, somewhere where you don't want to go--
Steve Kmetko
Astray.
Ted Lange
Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
Ted, one of the other things that really caught my attention when I was doing my research on you was something you did with Jenna Jameson.
Ted Lange
Yes. One of my fun things I did with Jenna Jameson.
Steve Kmetko
Jenna Jameson, for those who may not know I used to run into Jenna every year at the Can Film Festival because she was--
Ted Lange
Oh, did?
Steve Kmetko
Yes, she was there selling her wares.
Ted Lange
Yes.
Steve Kmetko
I mean, professionally.
Ted Lange
Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
But she was a very well-known and a very well-liked adult film star and you did--
Ted Lange
Yes. Some people say pornographic, but adult will work
Steve Kmetko
Adult sounds much nicer. You did a Sex and advice column with her?
Ted Lange
Yes, yes.
Steve Kmetko
Called Ask Isaac.
Ted Lange
Yes.
Steve Kmetko
Why Ask Isaac?
Ted Lange
Because I was the bartender. And from the television show, love Boat, people would come into the bar and they'd ask Isaac, hey Isaac, I got it done. And I would say, hey, do this. Now, what I did, my goal was to make sure it was a men's magazine, first of all. So, you got young men reading the magazine. So, my goal was, first of all, to make sure if they were having sex, that it was protected sex. So, I was a big advocate for condoms and then I tried to add humor into the advice. So, whatever you said, I was looking for the joke, whatever the question was, I was looking for the joke. So, I did that for a couple of years and they would fly me into New York and not with Jenna. Because What happened is Jenna's things. I said, what happened to Jenna James? Because they let her go and they got Beth Ostrosky Stern.
Who was Howard Stern's wife now, but back then she was dating Howard Stern. So, she got how they got her Beth to take Jenna's place because Jenna, everything she did, she would turn it around and it, if it was a question where she could hit on a girl, she would hit on the girl and say, and if that doesn't work, call me, you know. So, I think every once in a while, Beth used a Howard Stern joke because it was, Beth is much younger than Howard, and it was a joke I would've made being of this, of a certain age bracket. And but Beth, and so, I said, hi, how did you meet Howard? How did, so she told me the story. But that happened for when I would fly in to New York, they'd put me up and they'd take pictures of me with a sailor cap and a pipe, Allah, Hugh Hefner. And I would take pictures and Beth would be in the 90 of some kind. And she was gorgeous, almost as pretty as my wife. But--
Steve Kmetko
Nice Saved. Nice Saved.
Ted Lange
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. But yeah, that's, I did do that for a while, but the, my main goal was condoms and humor. If I could work those two things in the answer, then we were doing all right.
Steve Kmetko
Condoms can be pretty funny.
Steve Kmetko
Back with more in a moment.
Ted Lange
One time Cloris Leachman's daughter came on a cruise and she needed a shoulder to cry on and to talk to. Because She was going through a thing with her mom. And so, she came and knocked on my cabin door. I opened the door, I said, yeah, she's just cat on. I said, yeah, but I leave my door open because if I bring that girl into my cabin and close the door, you got to know this. There going to be some upset people. Girl was 17 too, at the time.
Steve Kmetko
Ted, what have you been doing lately?
Ted Lange
Well, when I was on Love Boat, I petitioned for four years to direct episodes.
Steve Kmetko
And, you got to, right?
Ted Lange
And finally in the fifth year, they let me direct episodes. And then I had a friend of mine that was a writer. Her name was Jean Ford. And she would pitch ideas to me. So, then I went back to the producer, I said, I'd like to write some episodes. So, they taught me some of the rudiments to writing. And then when the show was over, I kept on writing. Because I kept finding things that interest me. For instance, I gave you this flyer about my latest play which is about the first president of the United States. And that was a guy named John Hansen, not George Washington. And that's what I try to find things that, well, nobody knows that Everybody knows George Washington the first president, but he wasn't. He was the ninth president and they had eight guys before him. The first one was a guy named John Hanson.
But the difference was the United States had the Articles of Confederation, and then they went to Washington and said, hey, we need you to be president. He says, no, not until you get a better system. And he said, well, what do you mean? He says, well, I want a constitution. I don't want to do the United States with the Articles of Confederation. And so that's what my play is about. My play is about entertainment and information. So, what I try to do is entertain you about a situation you may not know about. I've, I've got another George Washington play called George Washington's Boy. And I did that about maybe 20 years ago. And that was all from the point of view of George Washington Slave. He had a slave named William Lee. And on his deathbed, he only freed one slave, and it was William Lee. And so, I actually got the same cast backed for this new play. And it's just a lot of fun. So, well, I write plays now. I've written 26, 27. This is my 27th play, John Hansen. And they're all, they go off in different directions. I've got a trilogy of historical plays. I've got comedies, and I've got Shakespeare in plays.
Steve Kmetko
I wanted to ask you about the first one you wrote, George Washington's boy because it's an interesting title.
Ted Lange
Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
And I'd like to know, as a person of color, how much does that weigh on you when you are writing a play?
Ted Lange
Well, that's the whole point of my doing. It was to do it from a person of color's point of view, at that time period in the 17 hundreds. So, they don't tell us so much.
Steve Kmetko
You know, I thought I paid attention in school, but apparently, I didn't.
Ted Lange
No, you paid attention. They just weren't telling you the deal. See, and that's what I do. For instance, George Washington, when he became president, he went to Philadelphia. In Pennsylvania, they had a law. If you keep a slave six months, you have to free him if they want their freedom. I never heard that.
Steve Kmetko
No.
Ted Lange
And so there was a chef, a cook that he had named Hercules. And this guy, actually, there's a painting of him, and they know about him at Mount Vernon. Because When I, whenever I write, I try to go to the different places. Because You pick up books and literature that you can't pick up nationally, but locally, they'll tell you things. I wrote a play on John Brown and Harper's Ferry, and there were five black guys with John Brown. They don't, they tell you about his sons. They tell you about John Brown and his sons. But there were five black guys with John Brown. And so, when I went to Harpers Ferry to research, I found books about these guys. You know, Frederick Douglass was supposed to be, if you know who Frederick Douglass is. Frederick Douglas was supposed to be at Harper's Ferry. And he secretly met with John Brown. And John Brown told him the plan, I need you to hive the bees, meaning to help me gather up the slaves so that we can start this thing. And, and when Frederick Douglass heard the plan, he said, no, that's a perfect steel trap. I'm not doing it. And so, he tells his bodyguard, he says, come on, let's go. And the bodyguard says, I think I'm going to go with the old man. And so, the bodyguard leaves Frederick Douglas and goes with John Brown. Man, I mean, when you tell the true history, it is so fascinating.
Steve Kmetko
Is this the same John Brown whose body lies a moldering in the grave?
Ted Lange
Same guy.
Steve Kmetko
Same guy.
Ted Lange
Same guy that inspired the revolution and inspired the Civil War. Same guy. And so, I've got an American revolutionary play. I've got a pre-Civil War play. And I have a Civil war play that I'm going to do in New York in September of 25. It's called Lady Patriot. And it's about a black slave girl who could read and write. And she was put in Jefferson Davis's house, his White House. And she was Spy, she was writing everything down because she could walk around the room cleaning. And they talked freely and openly. Nobody knows about her. And if you go to Virginia, I went to, I did a tour of the White House in Virginia, and they're clinging to the past. Boy, are they clinging. And so, they won't even acknowledge that this girl existed, but she did. Her name is Mary Bowser (Spy). And if you google that name, you'll find out about her. But if you really want to know about her, come see my play in New York in September, because I did the deep dive for you. So that's what I do. I'll find a subject that interests me, that I might think, maybe Steve doesn't know about this. Let me write something--
Steve Kmetko
That'd be a pretty safe bet.
Ted Lange
So let me write something. And then I start finding character. They don't realize in the history books, they kind of make them dry when they're teaching it. But if you really delve into the character, you see the personalities, you can see the personalities. James Buchanan, who was the president before Lincoln was gay.
Steve Kmetko
My people.
Ted Lange
Huh?
Steve Kmetko
My people.
Ted Lange
Yes. Well, nobody told us.
Steve Kmetko
Yeah.
Ted Lange
You know, that he was gay. He had a someone-- he had a senator that he was with, that he was his wife. And when that person died, he then called on, they called him a bachelor. Right. He was the bachelor.
Steve Kmetko
Confirmed.
Ted Lange
But yeah, confirmed bachelor. And then when he was still in the White House, he needed someone to hostess. So, he called his niece. Well, geez, that's incredibly fascinating. We don't know this stuff.
Steve Kmetko
No, we don't. And that's something else I'd like to ask you about. You know as a gay man, I've heard the words, [Uncertain Words], homo, you've heard colored black African American now.
Ted Lange
N word.
Steve Kmetko
N word. Oh, that's right. I didn't want to say it.
Ted Lange
Yeah. Let me tell you a story.
Steve Kmetko
Okay.
Ted Lange
Let me tell you a story.
Steve Kmetko
Alright.
Ted Lange
I was, well on the love boat, we would host A, B, C Parties. Okay. And we hosted an A, B, C party on the boat. And they had us at different tables. Okay? So I was at one table, and the president of A, B, C was at the table with me. I'm the only black guy at the table. So, the president said, hey, Ted, I got a joke for you. Funny, funny joke. And his wife says, don't tell that joke. So now I know it's a joke probably with the N word in it. And I'm the only guy at the table, right? So, I said, no, no, no, that's all right. Let's, let's talk about tennis. We were talking about tennis, and I'm taking tennis. He said, no, no, no. I want to tell you this joke, Ted.
It's really funny. And the wife says, don't tell the joke. And so, we sidetracked this guy, and he doesn't get me. Get to tell me the joke. Okay. off, guys. Off. Now, the culmination of that story is that years later, I wrote a play about four women called Four Queens. No, Trump, nothing to do with the president, but it has to do with playing a Trump card. Four queens, no, Trump. And this guy's son was a friend of mine, and the son had a wife who was in my production of Othello. So, she played Bianca. So, I said, hey I'm doing another play. Want you to come see us. So, she brings her husband, he loves the play. Now the president is the ex-president, and he's got to deal with A, B, C to produce shows. So, the kid says, I want my dad to come see this.
Let's make this a sitcom. Okay, great. So, he comes back eight more times, he's loving it. And finally, he gets his father to come see the show. Packed House, primarily a black audience. Oh, big laughs in this play. Intermission comes, comes to me and says, hey, Ted we got to go. My wife. We got to go. It's too hot in there. And, and excuse, excuse, excuse. But I'm looking at him and I'm thinking, you're still mad about that joke, you didn't get to tell me that joke. And had you got to tell me the joke, I might have had a half hour sitcom. But that's the kind of stuff, I mean that the stuff that I have had to deal with, you know? You can't be mad. You can't be mad if they see the anger in your eyes. You are done. So, you can't be mad. But you have to figure out a way for yourself to live with the situation they're going to put you in. So, they put me in a situation where this guy wants to tell a joke. If I can figure out a way that I don't have to be humiliated or be the butt of a joke, I'm going to try to figure that out, you know? But I--
Steve Kmetko
get past it on your terms--
Ted Lange
Yeah. I have to do it on my terms exactly. And that's the thing about Hollywood. One time Cloris Leachman daughter came on a cruise and she needed a shoulder to cry on and to talk to. Because She was going through a thing with her mom. And so, she came and knocked on my cabin door. I opened the door and I go, yeah. She says, can I talk to you? I said, yeah, but I leave my door open because if I bring that girl into my cabin and close the door, you got to know this. There're going to be some upset people. Girl was 17 too, at the time. So, anybody that walked past my cabin could see me talking to this girl. But nothing was going on. Now you got to know that. And I just saw recently where the guy from this is us, said the same thing. He said, yeah. And that's, this is now, you know, like a couple of years ago, he said he would sit, women would come to his trailer, white women would come to his trailer and he'd leave his dressing room door open because he couldn't close it. And you got to know that. You got to know what the deal is, you know?
Steve Kmetko
And we'll be right back.
Steve Kmetko
You became so well known as Isaac.
Ted Lange
Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
The black guy on a love boat.
Ted Lange
Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
Did you feel like that hurt your career at all the recognition?
Ted Lange
You know, I pivot.
Steve Kmetko
Hey, a more serious note here. I also read that you lost your mother to Covid.
Ted Lange
Yeah, yeah. Golly. Yeah. Yeah. My mother was a force of nature great talker, as my wife will tell you, that's where I get it from. And she was a pioneer in Bay Area Television. She had a talk show on PBS. Then when they started doing a local stations, like back then it was UHF, KBHK. She had a talk show on KBHK. And so, she would get on, she was very politically motivated. So, we always talked politics in our house. And that was very, very fortunate for me because listening to her taught me how to deal with these situations that I'm telling you about. You know one time this guy, the producer, wanted my mother to be a guest star on Love Boat. And he called her and said, you know, we want to bring, and he was trying to placate me without putting me --you know-- he is trying--
Steve Kmetko
Without putting you in the middle.
Ted Lange
Yeah, yeah, man. So, I called up my mom, I said, mom, I don't want you to do the show. She said, okay, no debate. That's my mom. You know, that's how we dealt. If she said to me, I need you to do this, boom. It was done. We had a great relationship. I had a great relationship with my father. Because My father was an actor in the fifties. My father was at a theater here in Los Angeles called the Ebony Showcase. Where they put black actors in White Place. So, take a giant step the detective story, all those plays that were done in New York in the fifties, they would come out here and they'd do them black. And the guy that did it was a guy named Nick Stewart. He owned Ebony Showcase, and he was Lightning on Amos and Andy, if you remember that, I don't know if you know that show at all--
Steve Kmetko
Oh, a little bit.
Ted Lange
Yeah. So, he was lightning, but he had a theater and he was training all of these guys. And one of the big guys, one of the first guys that he trained was a guy named Jimmy Edwards. Jimmy Edwards did one of the first integrated movies with Stanley Kramer. I forget the name of it, but Jimmy Edwards was in this movie, a war movie about a soldier that needs a blood transfusion. And he gets a blood transfusion from a black soldier. This is back in the fifties. And Jimmy said he was my father's best friend. We'd go over to the house and Jimmy Edwards said, I got the gig. And there were only 11 people in the audience, which means never slouch. If it's not enough people --you know-- don't say, well, who's going to never slouch?
You know, always do your best. Because There's 11 people there that need to see it, you know? So, home of the Brave, that was the name of the movie, home of the Brave Stanley Kramer and Jimmy Edwards, James Edwards was the star of that. And the last film he did was with George Campbell Scott Patton. He's the one at the end that dresses Patton. He's the Black Domo. I kind in a sense, I grew up around show business. And so, we, every summer, my brother and I would come down from the Bay Area and we'd see my dad in a play, you know? And my dad was a good little actor, but problem with my dad was, he was too fair. He was very fair skinned. Because It's from Louisiana. And back then you wanted dark because you were going to be in a Tarzan movie, jungle Gym. You were going to be a servant in a plantation movie. So, my father was too light. So, he towards the sixties, he would get one or two little film things. But basically, he was a stage actor. He never really got to do the deal, you know?
Steve Kmetko
Backtracking quite a bit. How did you get the role of Isaac?
Ted Lange
Oh, okay. I did a series called, that's My Mama.
Steve Kmetko
Right.
Ted Lange
Now, I'm not going to tell you that that was a series everybody was fighting on, because that wouldn't be right. But I did this series for two years called, that's My Mama. And after that, I left that series, and I had a very flamboyant character. And Viola Davis, if you ever read her book, I'm in her book. Because one of the things that inspired her was that character on, that's my mama.
Steve Kmetko
[Crosstalk]
Ted Lange
Yeah. Great actress. So, this next I, after that was ABC series. After that, I did another series with Pat Marita called Mr. T Andina. And in that series, it was written by the women, not the women Madeline Ru, no, Madeline--
Steve Kmetko
Q?
Ted Lange
Madeline Q and Bob Carroll Jr. Who were I Love Lucy Writers. They didn't have any Asians on this show, which again, goes back to what you're talking about earlier. Well, how come they didn't have, if they're doing a Japanese sitcom, why not have some Japanese writers on it?
Steve Kmetko
Right.
Ted Lange
They didn't do it. They gave the jobs to their friends. Okay. But on that series, I had a definitive character in my mind, and I played a custodian. So, I knew exactly what I wanted. I went to the costume department. I told them, this is what I want to do. And they had to run it by the producers. Of course, on that show, I would come in for three minutes. I what's the problem, Mr. T? Well, the pipes were okay, and I'd do my little bit. Now they, they, they would judge the last, when I came on, the left meter went up. When I left, it went back down.
Komack noticed that. So, when I went in, da, da, da, da, da, da, da da. So that's when he started saying, this kid is funny. We like this kid. We shot eight shows on the fourth show. They canceled us. Okay. So now they call my agent and say, we got a pilot and we want Ted to go in and interview with Doug Kramer. I go in to 20th Century Fox. Do Doug Kramer said, you get, do you get seasick? I said, no, I don't get seasick. Well, you know, do you ride a motorcycle? Yeah. Do you ride a horse? You know, everything is, give me the job. You know, do you get seasick? No, don't get seasick. He says the network likes you. I said, oh, great. Because now the network's paying attention because of I did this comedy and that comedy, and they're getting ready to come up with another comedy on a boat.
Yeah. Okay, cool. What do you want me to read? You don't have to read anything. I don't want me to read. No, it's okay. I leave. Now, this has been a Bone of Contention with Fred Grande and Bernie Capel. So, Bernie Capel, we're sitting around, you know, actors sit around like this. And so, so Bernie Capel says Hey, when did you come in for your screen test? I didn't see you there. And I knew there some of the other guys, but I didn't see you there. Did you come in early in the morning or did you come in late afternoon? Because I was there most of the day. I said, Bernie, I didn't audition. You didn't audition. I said, no, the really good actors didn't have to. And I said, so whenever, if you ever interviewed Bernie, ask him about that because I teased him for 10 years for like, we would do a scene and he mess up. I said, that's why you had to audition. You know? So, he and I, we that, see the thing about it was the actors I was with were wonderful actors. They were just one confident, not backbiting. You know what I mean? So that if the joke worked better with you, they gave it to you, you know?
Steve Kmetko
You became so well known as Isaac. The black guy on a love boat. Did you feel like that hurt your career at all the recognition?
Ted Lange
You know, I pivot. I pivot. Because There were a couple auditions, I know I would've been good for. Well, I could get mad. I could be bitter. I just pivot. And that's how my directing career. I direct a lot of theater and I write plays. I'm pivoting because I still want to be in show business. Because I was told Steve I was never going to make it in show business. And what, and to my surprise, what I found out, show business encompasses a lot of things. It's not just standing on stage, singing lines. You know, you could say in show business if you just direct place or direct television or direct movies. I directed Fall Guy because Lee Majors and I got drunk together. We were in Hong Kong, and I swear to God, his back was up against the wall of this hotel. And my back was up against the wall of the hotel because we were so drunk, we didn't want that build in the fall.
And so, during that, Lee May said, hey, I hear you direct. I go, yeah, I direct. He says why don't you direct my show? I said, oh, yeah, okay, cool. I'd love to direct your show, and don't worry. If you get into trouble, I'll help you. I said, I'm not, first of all, I'm not going to get into trouble. And second of all, I went to the American Film Institute. I studied directing --you know-- what are you talking about? If I get into trouble? No, no, don't worry. You get into trouble, I'll be there. Okay. Now here's a good Lee, major story. Okay? I'm directing. And the makeup guy says it's about the second day, third, maybe third day. And the makeup guy says, hey, how come Lee Majors is so nice to you? I said, what are you talking about?
He says, he tears directors apart, particularly new directors. He cuts them a new anus. Said, oh, really? Well, maybe they weren't that good because I'm a confident guy, right? So, he said, no, no, that doesn't make any sense. Because I've seen him do really good directors, dah, dah, dah da. So, we're doing a scene, and Lee likes the Stole Nia. That's what we did when we were in Hong Kong, stole Nia. So, we're doing a scene. And he had a refreshment earlier in the day. So, this is the late afternoon. And by the time we get to the late afternoon, he's got to be careful. And he did this thing where we're in a hospital room and he trips going to the bed where the heroin is --you know-- he trips, do the scene. And he said, cut. And we had done about maybe six other shots takes.
So, I said, let's do it again. And he says, wait one minute. I need to talk to you. Come here. So, I go over to him and we walk off the set. And as I'm walking off the set, I look at the makeup man. And he's doing, yes, yes. So, he takes me over and he said, what was wrong with that shot? I said, well, you tripped going to the bed. I'd like to get it clean. And he said, are you going to cover it? Meaning, are you going to take a closeup over the shoulders, da da da. I said, yeah, I'm going to cover it. He said let me tell you something. I'm not going for the envelope. I'm going for the parking lot. What does that mean?
Steve Kmetko
Yeah.
Ted Lange
He says, I'm not trying to win awards. I'm trying to get home by six o'clock. And I said, oh. I said, is that the rules? He said, yeah, you're right. That's the rules. I said, okay. I didn't know. I'm cool. I'm happy with that. He says, so that's the print. I said, no, let's do one more. And so, we walked back to the set. My nuts are clanging cl cl clang, because Lee Majors. Because What he did was he did, he kind of did this. I said, let's do one more. Okay. You know, because he knew I wanted the best out of him. I didn't want --you know-- I could've been sloppy and just, you know, fudged it, stay on a closeup as he walks over to the bed. But it would've been better if we see him go, you know? Anyway, so he and I became good friends. We became good. And I did a number of shows of the Fall guy. And just recently I was in Tennessee at one of those autograph shows. And I hadn't seen him in 30 years.
Steve Kmetko
Wow.
Ted Lange
And so, he lives in Houston. And so, I went over to him. I said, Hey. He said, Hey. And we caught up. It was great. We caught up.
Steve Kmetko
That's nice.
Ted Lange
Yeah, it is. It was really nice.
Steve Kmetko
What are some of the other roles you've played?
Ted Lange
Some of the, oh, I did Othello. I did a film, film.
Steve Kmetko
Shakespeare.
Ted Lange
Shakespeare. I did a film. I went to the Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts.
Steve Kmetko
That Lynn Redgrave wrote you a letter of recommendation.
Steve Kmetko
Lynn Redgrave wrote me a letter for, but see, I was directing her, and she would quote Shakespeare and I would quote Shakespeare. I did Rome and Joy. She did da, da, da da. And we were throwing back and she said, you should go to the rata. And I said, oh, Lynn, look, I make really good money. I'm famous. And I mean, really, what do I need with rata? And she looked at me and she said, oh, I'm sorry. I thought you were an actor. I went, whoa. Well wait a minute. Wait a minute. And so, I then investigated it after her. And then I went back to her and I said would you write me a letter of recommendation?
Steve Kmetko
You didn't say to her, Lynn, I'm going for the parking lot. Not the envelope. Didn't that?
Ted Lange
No, no, I didn't do that. So, but it, you know what, at that institution, I learned how to use words. You think you know how to use words. But when you study, and we were studying iambic pentameter --you know-- so there's certain emphasis on certain words. Heart, soft heart, soft heart, whatever. And I learned this thing, and that's where I got introduced to Othello. And so, they said, my teacher said, you should do this thing from Othello. I said, why? Why do all you Englishmen want us to do Othello? I want to do Richard ii. And he said, well, if you are afraid of O Fellow, no, I'm not afraid. Well then just do Othello. We'll get to Richard. Don't worry. We'll get to Rich. And so, I did Othello and I fell in love with the part. I fell in love with the part.
Now, oddly enough, I did a production of it in LA doing that production. I did it for black folks. It was in a community theater thing. Okay. Did this production of Ello, which incidentally, my wife came all the way from Orange County to see me do it and--
Steve Kmetko
That's a good wife.
Ted Lange
Yeah. Yeah. Well, she, she wasn't even a girlfriend then. Oh. And--
Steve Kmetko
Maybe she was auditioning.
Ted Lange
Yeah, man. So, I did it, and after I did it, I would meet black people and they would come up to me and say, hey, I saw you in Othello. I go, yeah. He said, well, what was this part about here? I said, didn't you get that? No, no. What was that? And so, then someone else would come up to me, hey, I saw you in Othello in iambic pentameter. Oh, thanks. hey, you know, when you did the thing and thing? What was that? So, what I did, Steve, was I wrote a prequel to Othello in iambic pentameter. Because White guys would say to you, oh, you wrote a prequel, huh? Yeah, but you didn't do it. And I said, no, I did what that gets him. I love it. I say, you wrote it iambic pentameter. Yes, I wrote it in iambic pentameter. So, but what it does is it shows the evolution of Othello all the way up to the first scene in Shakespeare's play. So, you see him meet Des Damon, you see him tell Des Damon stories, you see him break off his relationship with Amelia, who is Yao's wife. And you see Yago start to suspect that Othello was with his wife. So, you see all of that. So, it's a prequel too. And then you go right into Othello and you haven't lost a step.
So, that play is called the Cause My Soul, and actually it's on Amazon. I have three Shakespearean plays, Steve, I have the Cause My Soul, which is the prequel to Othello. I have the Heart of Shylock, which is Merchant of Venice. And it's all from Shylocks point of view, because originally it was a comedy, and they made Shylock the butt of the jokes. And when the previous president, I believe it was 45, did all of this stuff to immigrants, I wrote a play from an immigrant's point of view to let you, you know, I started to write a story about Mexicans, but it was too easy. You know, that's, but talking about Jews in Venice, in the 15 hundreds, the stuff they did then they were doing later, if you were Jewish and you were in Venice, you had to be behind the gates in the ghetto by six o'clock, if you were in the center of Venice and you were thirsty, you couldn't drink from the water fountain.
So, I did this whole research. And Murano's, you know what Murano is?
Steve Kmetko
Yes.
Ted Lange
Okay. I did a whole, I got a whole thing about Murano's in this play about Shylock. And his best friend in the play is Othello. And they both talk about being immigrants. So, I wrote this whole thing, and I've done readings of that. And then I got another one, a play called Shakespeare Over My Shoulder. And I did some research on Shakespeare. That Shakespeare it's --you know-- there is a debate about it. Shakespeare wrote all the plays. There's a big debate on this. And some people think it was Ed Edward DeVere. Some people think it was Francis Bacon. Some think it was Christopher Marlowe. And I wrote a play about who really wrote the plays, and I got these different sources. I was doing a lecture--
Steve Kmetko
I think it was Barry Manilow.
Ted Lange
No, it wasn't Barry. He would've sung it, but he wouldn't have wrote it. But so, I did these plays. I did this speech at a Shakespeare conference. Okay. And, and it was on Othello because I don't think William Shakespeare Roderigo Othello, I think it was a guy named Edward de vere. And then I put forth my thesis on this. And the thing, because the play is taken from a novella, everybody acknowledges the novella by a guy named Syntheo and Syntheo, Novella never made it to England. Shakespeare never left England. How did he find out about this? Edward de vere was in Venice. And there are things that people say that this is really peculiar to Venice. You have to be there to know this. That's in the play. So, I did this whole thing. Well, I'm with Shakespearean Scholars, so they come up to me and say, hey, Ted wasn't Edward de vere was it? No, it was Christopher Marlowe. Here's my book. I'm going to give you my book, read about Marlowe. I said, okay. Hey, Ted wasn't the vie, it was Francis Bacon. Here's my book on Francis Bacon. So, I got a. A book on Edward De Vere. I got one on Francis Bacon, I got another. And so, then I just started reading it and I said, there's a play in here. And then you got the guy Shakespeare, who wants to be on stage, he's an actor. And I put in every cliche that an actor goes through, I do it with this character of William Shakespeare wanting to be on stage and then segue into writing, you know, because the Nobles at that time couldn't attach their names to plays or it would anger the queen. So, what they did was they needed a front, they paid this guy, look, we're going to put your name on this Shakespeare, William Shakespeare. And Edward de vere changes it to Shakespeare later. But anyway, that's, so I've got a trilogy of plays on Amazon called Shakespeare Over My Shoulder, and it has those three plays in it.
Steve Kmetko
What was going through your head the morning after Love Boat wrapped?
Ted Lange
I thought I was going to go into the movies and do light comedy. That's what I thought. I thought because of my recognition factor that it would be easy, you know, and that so I was mapping out my career for movies. And then of, at first I did a pilot of, that's My Mama and I was the lead. Now I had been the minor character in it. They came to me, they said, love Boats rap. We want you to be the lead in this reboot of the series. Okay. They wrote it. And there was paid discrepancy. Okay.
Steve Kmetko
Yeah.
Ted Lange
Paid discrepancy. Okay. I had, Judy Landers was with my agent. Do you know Judy?
Steve Kmetko
Oh yeah. Judy and Audrey Landers.
Ted Lange
Yes. Judy was doing Whaling and Flowers. Whaling Flowers, and Madam.
Steve Kmetko
Right.
Ted Lange
She was getting 10,000 an episode and she was a minor character on the series. So, Columbia came to me and said, hey we want you to do this, da da da da da da. Okay. Oh, we're going to pay you 7,000. Whoa. Whoa. Wait a minute. I'm the star of this. Yeah, well, I want 10. So, this is, I'm going to tell you, this is fun. Okay? And you can't be mad. So, they said, well, if we pay you 10, we are going to have to, some other things are going to suffer because we're giving you 10. And I said, I tell you what, give me Columbia stock. Give me the seven and 3000 in Columbia stock. It'll be the 10. They go, oh no, we're not doing that. We're not doing that. So, I said, well, I want 10. And so finally they go, okay, you got to 10--
Steve Kmetko
Not, we'll give you 9,999,99 cents.
Ted Lange
Yeah. No, but here's where it gets Hollywood. So, I've agreed, sign the contract to do this thing. They come back to me and they say, Hey Ted, we got what's happening now, which is a reboot. We think we are going to need that to help us with your pilot. So, would you do a guest star on what's happening now? Oh yeah, sure. Absolutely. So top of the show, which means the most you can get is 2,500. Okay. Top of the show for a guest appearance. So, what's happening now opens up, Hey, it's time for Thanksgiving. Let's go to Washington DC and see my Aunt Blackout. The next 20 minutes is me focused on me, and that's my mama. The next 20 minutes, then at the end of the 20 minutes, ding-dong, hey, we came here for Thanksgiving. Come on in. Now what they did was they clipped off that end and clipped off the front, put in titles, put in end credits, and they never paid me $10,000. They paid me $2,500 for the pilot.
Steve Kmetko
That's Hollywood.
Ted Lange
That's Hollywood buddy.
Steve Kmetko
Ted, I've really enjoyed talking to you, listening to you. And you have no lack of curiosity, which is admirable. You'll, you'll go places.
Ted Lange
Yeah. Hopefully. Yeah.
Steve Kmetko
Thanks very much.
Ted Lange
Hopefully. Yeah, my pleasure, Steve. And I want you to know that I watched you all the time. Yeah. No, I used to watch you. Thank you. Good stuff, man.
Steve Kmetko
That's nice to hear.
Ted Lange
Yeah, it was good stuff.
Steve Kmetko
It's so long ago. I can't even remember it.
Ted Lange
Well, that may be a good thing. Who knows?
Steve Kmetko
Yeah, maybe. Thank you.
Ted Lange
My pleasure. Meeting you.
Steve Kmetko
Still Here Hollywood is a production of the Still Here Network. All things technical run by Justin Zangerle. Theme music by Brian Sanyshyn and executive producer is Jim Lichtenstein.